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- [bell tolling] [birds chirping]
- [dog barking in distance]
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00:00:10,866 --> 00:00:12,943
[car horn honks]
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[engine starts]
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♪♪
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♪♪
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♪♪
*MINDHUNTER*
Season 01 Episode 05
Title: "Episode #1.5"
7
00:02:13,928 --> 00:02:17,688
[man] His given name is Benjamin
Barnwright, but everybody calls him Benji.
8
00:02:17,765 --> 00:02:19,879
Came back to town,
just like I told you he would.
9
00:02:19,937 --> 00:02:22,661
Benji was home watching TV
the night Beverly Jean was killed?
10
00:02:22,719 --> 00:02:25,152
That's what he told us and I believe him.
11
00:02:25,272 --> 00:02:27,948
He let us search his car, no warrant.
12
00:02:28,025 --> 00:02:31,138
And we didn't find a thing
except for some of Beverly Jean's hair,
13
00:02:31,215 --> 00:02:33,474
but in the passenger seat,
like you'd expect it.
14
00:02:33,551 --> 00:02:37,434
Passenger seat's not the best way
to transport a corpse, I'll give you that.
15
00:02:37,511 --> 00:02:40,106
But you said he was home alone
watching TV?
16
00:02:40,183 --> 00:02:43,107
- That's not much of an alibi.
- Why?
17
00:02:43,416 --> 00:02:46,028
Isn't that what most people do
most nights of the week?
18
00:02:46,105 --> 00:02:48,010
Benjamin is definitely most people.
19
00:02:48,087 --> 00:02:50,075
He's worked the same job
ever since high school,
20
00:02:50,133 --> 00:02:51,450
bagging groceries at the A&P.
21
00:02:51,527 --> 00:02:54,912
Works at the A&P? Does he have access
to a delivery vehicle?
22
00:02:54,989 --> 00:02:57,162
Nope. Only works the floor.
23
00:03:19,160 --> 00:03:20,936
Is he expecting us?
24
00:03:21,495 --> 00:03:24,024
He's in mourning,
I thought it'd be polite to let him know.
25
00:03:24,101 --> 00:03:25,858
We should've brought a six pack.
26
00:03:33,841 --> 00:03:34,888
[thunder rumbles]
27
00:03:34,967 --> 00:03:36,779
- Can I get you some coffee?
- Sure.
28
00:03:36,845 --> 00:03:39,045
- It's instant.
- None for me, thanks.
29
00:03:40,222 --> 00:03:41,622
I'll wait.
30
00:03:43,225 --> 00:03:44,483
Uh...
31
00:03:44,560 --> 00:03:48,338
I got some donuts, too.
Half glazed, half cake.
32
00:03:50,357 --> 00:03:52,801
I'd love a donut. Thanks, Benjamin.
33
00:03:53,819 --> 00:03:55,690
Thanks for meeting with us,
Mr. Barnwright.
34
00:03:55,748 --> 00:03:56,796
Benjamin.
35
00:03:56,854 --> 00:03:59,518
I'm Bill Tench, this is Holden Ford.
We're with the FBI.
36
00:03:59,595 --> 00:04:01,687
He told me you'll be helping
with the case.
37
00:04:01,764 --> 00:04:03,502
We're sorry about your girlfriend.
38
00:04:03,579 --> 00:04:05,087
[tearful] I still can't believe it.
39
00:04:05,164 --> 00:04:07,568
- [Holden] How long were you with her?
- Eighteen months.
40
00:04:07,645 --> 00:04:09,612
So this was pretty serious.
41
00:04:09,689 --> 00:04:11,510
We just got engaged.
42
00:04:11,587 --> 00:04:12,988
[Tench] Big step.
43
00:04:14,131 --> 00:04:17,328
- I knew she was it when I met her.
- How'd you know?
44
00:04:17,405 --> 00:04:20,996
Uh, we saw things the same way.
45
00:04:21,138 --> 00:04:23,582
- [Holden] And you're how old?
- Twenty-six.
46
00:04:23,891 --> 00:04:27,461
You play sports in high school?
I'm guessing not the football team.
47
00:04:28,020 --> 00:04:30,214
- Band? Debate?
- No.
48
00:04:30,356 --> 00:04:31,965
Then what did you do?
49
00:04:32,483 --> 00:04:35,886
Uh, I... nothing.
50
00:04:38,531 --> 00:04:41,975
Well, you're doing good now.
Got your own place and everything.
51
00:04:42,368 --> 00:04:44,460
Got this place for Beverly Jean.
52
00:04:44,537 --> 00:04:46,271
[Holden] She ask you to move?
53
00:04:47,915 --> 00:04:50,150
I wanted us to have some privacy.
54
00:04:50,227 --> 00:04:51,884
Where were you before?
55
00:04:51,961 --> 00:04:53,969
A few blocks over on Chestnut.
56
00:04:54,046 --> 00:04:56,180
- With your family?
- Uh, with my mom.
57
00:04:56,257 --> 00:04:59,203
It must have been hard on her,
seeing you leave home.
58
00:04:59,280 --> 00:05:02,704
I think she was happy to see me move on.
59
00:05:03,722 --> 00:05:07,024
She loved Beverly Jean as much as I did.
60
00:05:07,101 --> 00:05:10,879
Mrs. Barnwright goes to my church, too.
First United Methodist.
61
00:05:11,355 --> 00:05:13,050
So you two know each other from church?
62
00:05:13,127 --> 00:05:14,865
Yeah. You and Rose.
63
00:05:14,942 --> 00:05:19,096
Mostly by sight now.
I don't go much anymore.
64
00:05:19,173 --> 00:05:22,456
Was your mother a disciplinarian?
65
00:05:22,533 --> 00:05:24,083
You mean strict?
66
00:05:24,160 --> 00:05:26,981
[Holden] Yeah. She crack the whip?
67
00:05:27,058 --> 00:05:28,670
Uh...
68
00:05:28,747 --> 00:05:30,524
She just cried.
69
00:05:30,666 --> 00:05:33,487
Well, I'm sure it was difficult
raising two kids without a dad.
70
00:05:33,564 --> 00:05:35,487
Yeah, he split when I was ten.
71
00:05:35,796 --> 00:05:39,116
- What was your father like?
- I don't much remember him.
72
00:05:39,675 --> 00:05:41,702
You and Beverly Jean ever fight?
73
00:05:42,845 --> 00:05:44,913
Perfectly normal for a young couple.
74
00:05:46,599 --> 00:05:48,292
Sometimes.
75
00:05:48,559 --> 00:05:50,199
[Tench] What'd you fight about?
76
00:05:50,276 --> 00:05:52,296
Just stupid stuff.
77
00:05:52,373 --> 00:05:53,716
Like what?
78
00:05:53,793 --> 00:05:55,340
Like, uh...
79
00:05:56,025 --> 00:05:57,843
what movie to go to.
80
00:05:58,360 --> 00:06:01,221
- [Tench] Any nerves around the engagement?
- No, sir.
81
00:06:02,156 --> 00:06:04,808
You got this place for her?
Did she like it?
82
00:06:06,535 --> 00:06:08,020
She, uh...
83
00:06:09,580 --> 00:06:13,090
She wanted to make it pretty
when she moved in.
84
00:06:13,167 --> 00:06:14,445
[Tench] When was that gonna be?
85
00:06:14,522 --> 00:06:16,611
- After the wedding.
- Traditional, huh?
86
00:06:16,795 --> 00:06:19,283
- Yeah.
- [Holden] Was that for your mother?
87
00:06:19,360 --> 00:06:21,950
That was just to keep it proper.
88
00:06:22,217 --> 00:06:24,453
Was she saving herself for marriage?
89
00:06:26,597 --> 00:06:29,333
Well, maybe she didn't want to wait.
90
00:06:29,850 --> 00:06:32,753
Girls like fooling around
just as much as boys.
91
00:06:33,562 --> 00:06:35,737
That's okay, Benjamin.
92
00:06:35,814 --> 00:06:37,382
We understand, that's...
93
00:06:37,900 --> 00:06:39,283
That's private.
94
00:06:39,360 --> 00:06:41,011
We'll keep it private.
95
00:06:42,404 --> 00:06:44,473
[Benjamin] Uh, well...
96
00:06:45,699 --> 00:06:48,310
Beverly Jean was, uh, my...
97
00:06:49,536 --> 00:06:51,104
first, uh...
98
00:06:51,288 --> 00:06:53,692
Your first sexual experience?
99
00:06:53,769 --> 00:06:55,233
Yeah.
100
00:06:56,543 --> 00:06:58,111
But she was nice.
101
00:06:59,755 --> 00:07:03,077
I don't know what all this has to do
with what happened to her...
102
00:07:03,154 --> 00:07:06,288
Listen, Benjamin.
We're from a particular unit of the FBI.
103
00:07:06,365 --> 00:07:09,208
We investigate murders
when there's a sexual angle.
104
00:07:09,285 --> 00:07:12,167
It may be unpleasant, but it's what we do.
105
00:07:14,478 --> 00:07:17,696
[sobbing]
106
00:07:17,773 --> 00:07:19,841
It's awful, what was done to her.
107
00:07:20,818 --> 00:07:22,511
Does he know?
108
00:07:23,737 --> 00:07:25,597
Mark, seriously?
109
00:07:27,324 --> 00:07:30,852
He only knows about the breasts.
It was another officer...
110
00:07:32,121 --> 00:07:35,025
- It's hard keeping this quiet.
- I want to talk to Mrs. Barnwright.
111
00:07:35,102 --> 00:07:37,382
Should we stop at a pay phone,
give her a heads up, too?
112
00:07:37,459 --> 00:07:39,426
- That'd be fair.
- [Holden] What about the tears?
113
00:07:39,503 --> 00:07:41,312
- I didn't buy them.
- Think he was faking?
114
00:07:41,370 --> 00:07:43,719
- [Tench] Seemed a bit much.
- [Mark] Given what he's been through?
115
00:07:43,776 --> 00:07:46,537
- It sure got us out of there.
- He's obviously a mama's boy.
116
00:07:46,614 --> 00:07:48,537
Or he knows how to play one.
117
00:07:49,305 --> 00:07:50,541
What do you mean?
118
00:07:50,618 --> 00:07:53,458
He was a virgin? He serves donuts?
119
00:07:53,559 --> 00:07:57,879
All of that could have been rehearsed,
especially since he knew we were coming.
120
00:07:59,481 --> 00:08:02,467
Benjamin has never seemed
like a performer to me.
121
00:08:03,217 --> 00:08:05,431
Two Feds in your living room
would make anybody nervous.
122
00:08:05,508 --> 00:08:08,183
Look at him, you think
he could have easily moved a body?
123
00:08:08,260 --> 00:08:10,102
Not without bursting into tears.
124
00:08:10,179 --> 00:08:11,517
[laughs]
125
00:08:15,622 --> 00:08:17,714
[woman] I always worried about Benjamin.
126
00:08:17,791 --> 00:08:20,529
[Tench] He was living with you
when he met Beverly Jean?
127
00:08:20,606 --> 00:08:25,490
- He was so excited to have a girlfriend.
- Did she reciprocate those feelings?
128
00:08:26,050 --> 00:08:27,995
He said that she was crazy about him.
129
00:08:28,072 --> 00:08:30,579
- Did you meet her?
- Of course.
130
00:08:31,305 --> 00:08:32,666
What were they like together?
131
00:08:32,743 --> 00:08:35,417
Well, they were... normal.
132
00:08:35,768 --> 00:08:39,880
She teased him a lot. He pretended
not to enjoy it, but I know he did.
133
00:08:40,606 --> 00:08:43,592
Benjamin told us
the two of them argued sometimes.
134
00:08:44,777 --> 00:08:46,595
Did you see him?
135
00:08:47,488 --> 00:08:48,972
This morning.
136
00:08:50,699 --> 00:08:52,517
Is he in trouble?
137
00:08:53,410 --> 00:08:57,689
We're just going over the case again,
talking to everyone who knew Beverly Jean.
138
00:08:58,165 --> 00:09:02,110
Well... I never heard them argue.
139
00:09:02,836 --> 00:09:06,013
Benjamin is soft, you know.
140
00:09:06,090 --> 00:09:07,618
What was he like as a kid?
141
00:09:07,695 --> 00:09:12,245
He was always sensitive.
But when his father ran off, he just...
142
00:09:14,848 --> 00:09:16,333
[Holden] What do you mean?
143
00:09:17,768 --> 00:09:19,252
Well...
144
00:09:19,561 --> 00:09:22,049
he started to cry a lot, wet the bed.
145
00:09:22,107 --> 00:09:24,566
- He wouldn't leave the house.
- [Holden] That must have been difficult.
146
00:09:24,623 --> 00:09:27,552
I had to leave the kids
on their own a lot.
147
00:09:27,629 --> 00:09:31,306
Rose helped out,
but she was just so little.
148
00:09:33,826 --> 00:09:36,895
Those were hard years.
I did a lot of praying.
149
00:09:38,831 --> 00:09:41,983
But then Rose met Frank
and he moved in with us.
150
00:09:42,126 --> 00:09:43,819
Frank Janderman.
151
00:09:43,961 --> 00:09:45,155
[woman] That's right.
152
00:09:45,232 --> 00:09:47,282
They just had a baby, you know.
153
00:09:47,359 --> 00:09:49,074
Your first grandchild?
154
00:09:49,425 --> 00:09:51,159
Congratulations.
155
00:09:52,094 --> 00:09:56,605
People talked about Frank back then,
but I never listened to all that.
156
00:09:56,682 --> 00:09:59,586
I loved him from the first time I met him.
I still do.
157
00:09:59,663 --> 00:10:01,711
Did Benjamin feel the same way?
158
00:10:02,813 --> 00:10:04,883
Well, he started to go out, you know.
159
00:10:04,960 --> 00:10:07,175
He became friends with Frank.
160
00:10:07,401 --> 00:10:09,177
Frank protected him.
161
00:10:09,862 --> 00:10:12,264
He wouldn't let anyone near Rose.
162
00:10:13,574 --> 00:10:17,185
He even got Benji a job
so I didn't have to work two shifts.
163
00:10:17,995 --> 00:10:21,815
Sometimes Rose said
I loved him more than she did.
164
00:10:23,959 --> 00:10:25,360
When was this?
165
00:10:26,962 --> 00:10:29,324
Well, uh... they got married at 18,
166
00:10:29,401 --> 00:10:32,284
so Rose must have been...
167
00:10:34,344 --> 00:10:36,246
15, 16 at the time.
168
00:10:36,388 --> 00:10:39,124
Frank moved in. Why?
169
00:10:40,517 --> 00:10:42,294
Well, I don't remember.
170
00:10:43,228 --> 00:10:47,048
He had some problems at home
with his father, as young boys do.
171
00:10:47,900 --> 00:10:50,345
But he got them their own place
when they married.
172
00:10:50,422 --> 00:10:53,555
And Benjamin lived at home with you
until he met Beverly Jean?
173
00:10:56,200 --> 00:10:58,310
It's been a strange time.
174
00:10:59,119 --> 00:11:01,648
We were so happy that Rose and Frank
were having a baby,
175
00:11:01,725 --> 00:11:07,110
and then Benjamin loses his love
in such a horrible way. [sobs]
176
00:11:12,841 --> 00:11:14,743
Like mother, like son.
177
00:11:14,843 --> 00:11:17,162
You think there's a gene for crying?
178
00:11:17,346 --> 00:11:20,500
I keep wondering why Beverly was
with him in the first place.
179
00:11:20,577 --> 00:11:24,669
She might have liked that he was older,
easy to talk to. He's sensitive.
180
00:11:24,746 --> 00:11:26,882
"Half glazed, half cake"?
181
00:11:26,959 --> 00:11:28,297
Sure.
182
00:11:28,982 --> 00:11:33,428
I bet Beverly had poor old pipsqueak Benji
wrapped around her golden triangle.
183
00:11:33,528 --> 00:11:37,059
Maybe she wanted a nice guy
with a steady income who loved her.
184
00:11:37,136 --> 00:11:39,267
Whatever you say, Ocasek.
185
00:11:39,701 --> 00:11:41,001
What's that?
186
00:11:41,078 --> 00:11:43,313
We were just saying there's not much here.
187
00:11:43,830 --> 00:11:45,776
I assured Mrs. Barnwright
this was a formality.
188
00:11:45,853 --> 00:11:49,069
- It's not a formality.
- Well, I can tell her it is.
189
00:11:49,378 --> 00:11:51,196
So where does this leave us?
190
00:11:52,167 --> 00:11:53,242
There's still Alvin.
191
00:11:53,319 --> 00:11:56,370
You don't want it to be someone
in the community. Neither of you do.
192
00:11:56,447 --> 00:11:59,644
Who drives all this way
to come to some rust belt town?
193
00:11:59,721 --> 00:12:02,292
If you're hunting for girls,
you got big cities.
194
00:12:02,369 --> 00:12:04,441
You got freeways with hitchhikers.
195
00:12:04,518 --> 00:12:06,294
Why choose a place like this?
196
00:12:07,062 --> 00:12:09,381
How would a drifter
know where the dump is?
197
00:12:17,239 --> 00:12:18,830
- Hi.
- There you are.
198
00:12:18,907 --> 00:12:21,597
I got all kinds of fun things
for you to look over.
199
00:12:21,655 --> 00:12:22,687
Ooh. Paperwork?
200
00:12:22,745 --> 00:12:25,982
Yeah, it's hardly sexy, but I'm trying
to put together a list of questions
201
00:12:26,040 --> 00:12:27,486
for the killers that you interview.
202
00:12:27,544 --> 00:12:29,966
Things like family history, mood,
203
00:12:30,043 --> 00:12:32,322
thought patterns before, during,
and after the crime.
204
00:12:32,399 --> 00:12:36,097
This is just a first draft, but look it
over and let me know what you think.
205
00:12:36,181 --> 00:12:39,056
Shouldn't we tailor the interviews
based on the killer's personality?
206
00:12:39,147 --> 00:12:40,176
You mean just wing it?
207
00:12:40,259 --> 00:12:42,624
With these guys,
we need to look for different ways in.
208
00:12:42,701 --> 00:12:46,751
Yes, but we still need a data set
that's consistent across all our subjects.
209
00:12:47,618 --> 00:12:48,693
You leaving?
210
00:12:48,770 --> 00:12:50,637
- Back to Boston.
- You just got here.
211
00:12:50,754 --> 00:12:54,026
Well, until you conduct more interviews,
there's really nothing for me to do here.
212
00:12:54,088 --> 00:12:57,762
We had a really interesting conversation
with the fiancé of that victim in Altoona.
213
00:12:59,364 --> 00:13:02,183
- I got a taxi waiting.
- Cancel it. I'll drive you.
214
00:13:08,373 --> 00:13:10,692
- Let me take your bag.
- Thank you.
215
00:13:11,626 --> 00:13:15,029
He lost it. I've never seen a guy
cry like that.
216
00:13:15,547 --> 00:13:16,972
Bill was skeptical.
217
00:13:17,049 --> 00:13:19,117
- But you believed him?
- It looked real.
218
00:13:19,551 --> 00:13:21,851
Well, how did it feel?
I mean, were you moved?
219
00:13:21,928 --> 00:13:24,249
- Did you want to comfort him?
- I wanted him to stop.
220
00:13:24,326 --> 00:13:25,917
Why'd you want him to stop?
221
00:13:25,994 --> 00:13:28,126
I don't know, maybe I'm just callous.
222
00:13:28,894 --> 00:13:30,837
Try a little harder, Holden.
223
00:13:34,483 --> 00:13:35,967
It felt wrong.
224
00:13:36,401 --> 00:13:41,055
Benjamin was blubbering like a baby,
but it didn't seem vulnerable.
225
00:13:41,448 --> 00:13:43,266
It felt hostile.
226
00:13:43,492 --> 00:13:47,877
You know, psychopaths are extremely
skilled at imitating human emotions.
227
00:13:47,954 --> 00:13:49,733
It's how they manipulate other people
228
00:13:49,810 --> 00:13:52,132
or how they gain power
over their environment.
229
00:13:52,209 --> 00:13:54,551
How do they understand emotions
if they don't have them?
230
00:13:54,628 --> 00:13:57,574
Well, they have emotions. They just
don't believe other people have them.
231
00:13:57,651 --> 00:14:01,370
Or more specifically, they don't believe
that other people have interior lives.
232
00:14:01,447 --> 00:14:02,767
How do we sniff them out?
233
00:14:02,844 --> 00:14:05,332
Well, it seems like you just did.
Trust your instincts.
234
00:14:05,409 --> 00:14:10,418
The whole town sees Benjamin as this lost
little puppy that needs protecting.
235
00:14:10,685 --> 00:14:12,130
Maybe my instincts are wrong.
236
00:14:12,207 --> 00:14:16,633
Well, we're developing a methodology,
so use it.
237
00:14:18,527 --> 00:14:20,869
Look at where the perpetrator went.
238
00:14:20,946 --> 00:14:23,913
Hair, breasts, vagina,
all symbols of her sexual power.
239
00:14:23,990 --> 00:14:27,292
Disfiguring her reproductive organs
was a way to neutralize her.
240
00:14:27,369 --> 00:14:30,399
What about the hair on the ironing board?
Was that some kind of display?
241
00:14:30,476 --> 00:14:32,589
Like a trophy.
A way to assert his dominance.
242
00:14:32,666 --> 00:14:36,321
Benjamin is anything but assertive.
Beverly's the first woman he slept with.
243
00:14:36,398 --> 00:14:37,844
- How old is he?
- Twenty-six.
244
00:14:37,921 --> 00:14:40,555
So that would give the relationship
an extra significance.
245
00:14:40,632 --> 00:14:42,661
Bill thinks the only reason
she was with him
246
00:14:42,738 --> 00:14:45,122
is because she has total
sexual control over him.
247
00:14:45,199 --> 00:14:47,520
Well, what's her history?
Was she a virgin, too?
248
00:14:47,597 --> 00:14:48,834
He was touchy about that.
249
00:14:48,911 --> 00:14:53,026
So then she had some experience,
which could either excite or threaten him.
250
00:14:53,103 --> 00:14:55,716
In the photo,
she looks like the girl next door.
251
00:14:55,793 --> 00:14:59,551
You really believe that a young,
pretty girl can't be manipulative?
252
00:14:59,818 --> 00:15:02,035
[Carr] Even if she
was using sex to control him,
253
00:15:02,112 --> 00:15:03,974
and you have absolutely no evidence
for this,
254
00:15:04,051 --> 00:15:07,728
then it would be what many women do
to have an ounce of power in this world.
255
00:15:07,805 --> 00:15:09,604
Fine, but if it went too far,
256
00:15:09,681 --> 00:15:12,170
if something happened
and Benjamin snapped,
257
00:15:12,247 --> 00:15:14,506
could feelings of impotence
explain his rage?
258
00:15:14,583 --> 00:15:18,029
Could it explain him going back four days
later to cut her up like you said,
259
00:15:18,106 --> 00:15:20,512
- as an attempt to assert control?
- Possibly.
260
00:15:20,589 --> 00:15:23,076
But then wouldn't the rape
already have accomplished that?
261
00:15:23,153 --> 00:15:25,350
- Accomplish control?
- Exactly.
262
00:15:25,427 --> 00:15:28,081
In all the crimes we've studied,
there's never been an example
263
00:15:28,158 --> 00:15:30,355
of a victim being raped
then depersonalized.
264
00:15:30,432 --> 00:15:32,357
If the killer mutilates her after death,
265
00:15:32,434 --> 00:15:34,755
then he usually commits sexual acts
after death as well.
266
00:15:34,832 --> 00:15:37,549
To make up for his sense of inadequacy
while she was still alive.
267
00:15:37,626 --> 00:15:40,427
It's like there's two different
presentations in this crime scene.
268
00:15:40,504 --> 00:15:43,052
[indistinct PA announcement]
269
00:15:43,987 --> 00:15:46,222
Anybody picking you up in Boston?
270
00:15:46,364 --> 00:15:48,850
I'll grab a cab. Bye.
271
00:15:49,159 --> 00:15:52,049
♪♪ Rock music plays...
272
00:15:52,222 --> 00:15:54,784
♪♪
273
00:15:55,040 --> 00:15:57,465
[doorbell rings]
274
00:15:57,542 --> 00:16:00,195
- Hey.
- Hey. What are you...
275
00:16:03,465 --> 00:16:05,450
- Up to?
- Studying.
276
00:16:05,592 --> 00:16:06,953
Pulling an all-nighter.
277
00:16:07,030 --> 00:16:10,622
Writing a paper on C. Wright Mills
and the power elite.
278
00:16:11,681 --> 00:16:13,333
Due tomorrow.
279
00:16:14,393 --> 00:16:16,463
It's about the people
who really run this country.
280
00:16:16,540 --> 00:16:19,380
Hardly what our democracy
is supposed to be about.
281
00:16:19,898 --> 00:16:21,990
- Are you okay?
- What?
282
00:16:22,067 --> 00:16:24,221
- You seem...
- Oh. My friend gave me diet pills.
283
00:16:24,298 --> 00:16:26,804
- Really?
- Speed actually makes this interesting.
284
00:16:29,407 --> 00:16:30,892
May I see those?
285
00:16:32,786 --> 00:16:35,398
Great for concentration,
keeps you totally focused.
286
00:16:35,475 --> 00:16:38,652
- Beer? Coffee? Tea?
- Is this legal?
287
00:16:38,729 --> 00:16:41,319
Uh-oh. Out comes the narc.
288
00:16:44,714 --> 00:16:49,792
We were digging into his relationship
with the fiancé and he burst into tears.
289
00:16:49,850 --> 00:16:51,206
Bill thought he was bullshitting,
290
00:16:51,283 --> 00:16:55,043
but psychopaths are extremely skilled
at imitating human emotions.
291
00:16:55,120 --> 00:16:57,126
I once went crying to my professor.
292
00:16:58,520 --> 00:16:59,611
You fake cried?
293
00:16:59,688 --> 00:17:02,843
Made up an elaborate story about my dad
in some horrendous accident.
294
00:17:02,920 --> 00:17:04,741
- When was this?
- My freshman year.
295
00:17:04,818 --> 00:17:08,012
I was partying a little too much,
almost flunked out of school.
296
00:17:08,655 --> 00:17:09,766
The interesting thing was,
297
00:17:09,843 --> 00:17:12,433
while I was lying,
I actually started believing it.
298
00:17:12,576 --> 00:17:14,793
Made for a good show.
He raised my grade to a C.
299
00:17:14,870 --> 00:17:16,106
- Your teacher was male.
- So?
300
00:17:16,183 --> 00:17:19,798
Women crying to men always works.
Men to men? [scoffs]
301
00:17:19,875 --> 00:17:22,944
- Not my point.
- Why were you drinking so much?
302
00:17:24,087 --> 00:17:28,056
I wanted to fit in.
I wanted to be wild and crazy.
303
00:17:28,133 --> 00:17:30,827
- Why?
- I was tired of always thinking.
304
00:17:31,052 --> 00:17:33,913
- Don't you get tired of thinking?
- No.
305
00:17:34,723 --> 00:17:37,292
And it made it easier
to sleep with people.
306
00:17:41,938 --> 00:17:45,302
- How many people did you sleep with?
- [sighs] Let's not.
307
00:17:45,379 --> 00:17:48,096
- A lot?
- What difference does that make?
308
00:17:48,173 --> 00:17:50,972
- Just curious.
- And judgmental.
309
00:17:52,324 --> 00:17:53,725
Five...
310
00:17:54,784 --> 00:17:57,145
- Ten...
- This is getting tedious.
311
00:17:59,873 --> 00:18:03,526
- Ten?
- Holden... I'm not doing this.
312
00:18:05,962 --> 00:18:07,240
[whispers] Ten.
313
00:18:07,317 --> 00:18:09,138
[distant gunfire]
314
00:18:09,215 --> 00:18:10,615
[Tench] Uh-huh.
315
00:18:12,385 --> 00:18:15,603
- Jesus.
- [man] I know. What do we do?
316
00:18:15,680 --> 00:18:17,375
- Hell, pick him up.
- What do I tell him?
317
00:18:17,452 --> 00:18:21,171
Don't tell him anything. Let him stew
for a few hours until we get there.
318
00:18:21,248 --> 00:18:22,586
Okay.
319
00:18:23,772 --> 00:18:25,840
Ocasek looked into Frank Janderman.
320
00:18:25,982 --> 00:18:29,095
Apparently, in high school,
he was sent to a psychiatric hospital
321
00:18:29,172 --> 00:18:31,262
for taking a monkey wrench to a girl.
322
00:18:31,947 --> 00:18:34,474
- Frank Janderman?
- Rose's husband.
323
00:18:37,410 --> 00:18:39,187
We should get this on tape.
324
00:18:42,707 --> 00:18:45,133
So I got to thinking,
why did Mrs. Barnwright
325
00:18:45,210 --> 00:18:47,635
say people were talking
about Frank back then?
326
00:18:47,712 --> 00:18:49,699
- What were they talking about, right?
- Right.
327
00:18:49,776 --> 00:18:52,369
So I talked to this family court judge
who's a friend of mine.
328
00:18:52,446 --> 00:18:54,142
Sure enough, he remembers the case.
329
00:18:54,200 --> 00:18:56,350
Since Frank was a juvenile
when the assault occurred,
330
00:18:56,408 --> 00:18:57,697
the court sealed the records.
331
00:18:57,847 --> 00:19:00,708
Fortunately, the judge
is a very good friend of mine.
332
00:19:01,059 --> 00:19:03,099
Here's what we've got on Frank's hearing,
333
00:19:04,229 --> 00:19:05,590
and his time at Warren State.
334
00:19:05,667 --> 00:19:07,196
Nice work, Mark.
335
00:19:07,273 --> 00:19:10,116
This is where your community system
pays off.
336
00:19:10,193 --> 00:19:12,222
He's been here since nine.
Maybe we should...
337
00:19:12,299 --> 00:19:13,638
Let him wait.
338
00:19:15,031 --> 00:19:16,974
Why don't we have a cup of coffee?
339
00:19:17,575 --> 00:19:20,228
If Frank's a hothead,
it'll irritate him, throw him off.
340
00:19:22,330 --> 00:19:23,838
Class of '71?
341
00:19:23,915 --> 00:19:26,651
- Yep.
- You go to your five-year reunion?
342
00:19:27,252 --> 00:19:29,566
I don't really keep up with that stuff.
343
00:19:29,785 --> 00:19:32,993
It's commendable that you graduated,
seeing as how you missed your junior year.
344
00:19:33,070 --> 00:19:35,453
What do you want from me?
I've been here all day.
345
00:19:35,530 --> 00:19:38,913
- I answered all your questions last week.
- We just have a few more.
346
00:19:40,432 --> 00:19:42,250
You've got everyone in a tizzy.
347
00:19:42,642 --> 00:19:44,129
- You mean Benjamin?
- Yeah.
348
00:19:44,206 --> 00:19:48,738
The whole family. Me, my wife, mom.
You scared the shit out of Benji.
349
00:19:48,815 --> 00:19:51,449
[sighs] I'm sorry if we scared everyone.
350
00:19:51,526 --> 00:19:53,451
And for keeping you for so long.
351
00:19:53,528 --> 00:19:55,642
Beverly Jean Shaw was close
with your family.
352
00:19:55,720 --> 00:19:57,517
We're simply looking
for a little background.
353
00:19:57,594 --> 00:19:58,933
She wasn't that close.
354
00:19:59,815 --> 00:20:01,567
She was about to marry
your brother-in-law.
355
00:20:01,652 --> 00:20:03,116
They hadn't set a date.
356
00:20:03,705 --> 00:20:06,901
- I didn't spend a lot of time with him.
- You and Benjamin aren't close?
357
00:20:06,978 --> 00:20:09,235
What's this "close" shit?
That's like women.
358
00:20:10,336 --> 00:20:12,697
Mrs. Barnwright said
you looked out for him.
359
00:20:13,381 --> 00:20:16,701
- Well, yeah, he's a shrimp.
- And he's your brother-in-law.
360
00:20:16,885 --> 00:20:18,017
Yep.
361
00:20:18,094 --> 00:20:21,289
- So you would help him if he needed it.
- Yep.
362
00:20:23,933 --> 00:20:26,169
Did you fight a lot in high school?
363
00:20:26,352 --> 00:20:27,752
Like Popeye.
364
00:20:30,065 --> 00:20:33,551
How'd you land yourself
in Warren State Psychiatric Hospital?
365
00:20:36,321 --> 00:20:38,347
It's probably in your fucking file.
366
00:20:38,490 --> 00:20:40,308
We want to hear your side.
367
00:20:41,284 --> 00:20:43,728
[exhales]
368
00:20:43,828 --> 00:20:46,399
This girl freaked out on me,
came after me with a wrench.
369
00:20:46,476 --> 00:20:49,110
I tried to get it,
it swang back, hit her in the face.
370
00:20:49,187 --> 00:20:51,652
Then all this shit
came raining down on me.
371
00:20:52,170 --> 00:20:53,636
Why'd she freak out?
372
00:20:53,713 --> 00:20:57,035
- I was seeing some other girl, too.
- You a ladies man?
373
00:20:57,112 --> 00:20:59,160
Maybe. Back then.
374
00:20:59,636 --> 00:21:02,353
- They sent you to a mental institution.
- That was bullshit.
375
00:21:02,430 --> 00:21:05,064
- I had to go, it was part of the plea.
- You did a plea deal?
376
00:21:05,141 --> 00:21:07,212
Why not go to court,
tell them what you told us?
377
00:21:07,289 --> 00:21:10,922
My lawyer said I'd never win
against a sweet girl with a broken nose.
378
00:21:12,015 --> 00:21:15,053
There were other infractions, I was
running around like a jackass back then.
379
00:21:15,130 --> 00:21:18,846
- But no longer?
- I'm married now. Got a kid.
380
00:21:18,988 --> 00:21:21,768
Marriage and fatherhood
don't make anger go away.
381
00:21:21,845 --> 00:21:24,187
I wasn't angry, I was just...
382
00:21:24,264 --> 00:21:26,187
Misunderstood?
383
00:21:26,621 --> 00:21:29,690
Makes me sound like a pussy, but yeah.
384
00:21:30,542 --> 00:21:33,486
Want to tell us about the night
Beverly Jean disappeared?
385
00:21:33,878 --> 00:21:35,198
[sighs heavily]
386
00:21:35,275 --> 00:21:39,307
I don't know. It was, uh...
typical, I guess.
387
00:21:39,384 --> 00:21:41,661
Rose was still pregnant back then.
388
00:21:41,761 --> 00:21:43,915
Got her some dinner and watched TV.
389
00:21:43,992 --> 00:21:46,126
- So you were home all night.
- No.
390
00:21:46,203 --> 00:21:47,833
No?
391
00:21:48,101 --> 00:21:51,295
No. I told you,
I went out and got us dinner.
392
00:21:51,396 --> 00:21:52,882
How long were you gone?
393
00:21:52,959 --> 00:21:55,677
I don't know, 15, 20 minutes maybe.
394
00:21:55,754 --> 00:21:57,408
Where'd you get food?
395
00:21:57,485 --> 00:21:59,848
Rose likes the rolls at Hannah's Diner
on Market Street.
396
00:21:59,925 --> 00:22:01,806
And Rose will confirm this?
397
00:22:02,740 --> 00:22:05,478
Am I under some kind of suspicion here?
398
00:22:05,555 --> 00:22:09,230
We're just looking at it from every angle.
399
00:22:10,582 --> 00:22:13,194
No, Beverly Jean was, uh...
was Benji's girl.
400
00:22:13,271 --> 00:22:14,592
I barely knew her.
401
00:22:14,669 --> 00:22:17,740
Strange, seeing as how she was
about to be part of the family.
402
00:22:17,817 --> 00:22:18,971
[exhales]
403
00:22:19,048 --> 00:22:21,224
Stop saying it like that.
404
00:22:21,301 --> 00:22:23,661
You said they hadn't set a date
for the wedding.
405
00:22:24,220 --> 00:22:27,292
- It was loose.
- They were engaged, weren't they?
406
00:22:27,369 --> 00:22:28,606
[sighs]
407
00:22:28,683 --> 00:22:30,543
Benji thought they were.
408
00:22:32,562 --> 00:22:37,365
The impression I got is that she was
in love with him, wanted to marry him.
409
00:22:37,442 --> 00:22:40,034
Oh, man, I don't want to rain
on his parade...
410
00:22:40,111 --> 00:22:42,493
You're saying he made the relationship
more than what it was?
411
00:22:42,550 --> 00:22:44,580
She let him call her his girlfriend.
412
00:22:44,657 --> 00:22:46,102
He got that apartment for her.
413
00:22:46,179 --> 00:22:48,521
Yeah, that was the big plan,
get her to move in.
414
00:22:48,598 --> 00:22:51,981
- Was Beverly even sleeping with him?
- Now and again.
415
00:22:52,112 --> 00:22:54,485
A looker like her, he thought he'd died
and gone to heaven.
416
00:22:54,562 --> 00:22:57,635
- You found her attractive?
- She's a seven.
417
00:22:57,712 --> 00:23:00,179
Really? From the photos,
I'd give her an eight.
418
00:23:00,256 --> 00:23:01,991
In Altoona, she's a solid eight.
419
00:23:02,926 --> 00:23:06,037
I thought Benji had done
pretty good for himself.
420
00:23:06,554 --> 00:23:08,539
Especially for a guy who's...
421
00:23:09,349 --> 00:23:11,042
so quick to cry.
422
00:23:11,218 --> 00:23:12,295
Shit, yeah.
423
00:23:12,372 --> 00:23:15,755
Do you think that he was satisfying her?
424
00:23:17,607 --> 00:23:19,258
[exhales]
425
00:23:19,609 --> 00:23:22,493
- I don't think he was blowing her mind.
- She tell you that?
426
00:23:22,570 --> 00:23:25,725
Not in so many words, but when a chick's
enjoying it, she's all over you.
427
00:23:25,802 --> 00:23:27,850
You think Beverly Jean
knew the difference?
428
00:23:28,284 --> 00:23:31,854
You think she'd, you know...
been around?
429
00:23:32,830 --> 00:23:36,567
I'd say she was, uh... open.
430
00:23:39,379 --> 00:23:41,299
[Holden] Benjamin see it that way too?
431
00:23:41,376 --> 00:23:44,408
I don't know if he didn't get it
or he didn't want to.
432
00:23:53,476 --> 00:23:56,631
Everyone we interviewed
said Beverly Jean was...
433
00:23:56,708 --> 00:24:00,218
nice, loyal, decent.
434
00:24:00,295 --> 00:24:01,633
Well...
435
00:24:03,277 --> 00:24:06,140
no one's gonna come right out
and say the dead girl was easy.
436
00:24:06,217 --> 00:24:09,600
Frank's cagey. You hear him deflect
on that deal in high school?
437
00:24:09,963 --> 00:24:11,980
He could have made that up
about her being a slut.
438
00:24:12,057 --> 00:24:13,294
What if he didn't?
439
00:24:13,371 --> 00:24:16,234
Listen, if Beverly had the upper hand
in the relationship
440
00:24:16,311 --> 00:24:19,402
and made Benjamin feel jealous
by seeing other men,
441
00:24:20,003 --> 00:24:22,887
if Benjamin felt sexually powerless,
442
00:24:22,964 --> 00:24:26,117
he might lash out with the kind of anger
we see in this crime.
443
00:24:26,342 --> 00:24:28,496
Let's see what Benjamin has to say.
444
00:24:28,573 --> 00:24:30,519
- Bring him in?
- Yeah.
445
00:24:30,596 --> 00:24:32,521
You understand you're not under arrest?
446
00:24:32,598 --> 00:24:35,837
You're free to leave at any point,
only have to talk to us if you want to.
447
00:24:35,914 --> 00:24:38,314
And you're okay with us
recording this conversation?
448
00:24:38,372 --> 00:24:40,508
It's just so much easier
than writing everything down.
449
00:24:40,585 --> 00:24:42,967
Yeah. I want to help if I can.
450
00:24:43,693 --> 00:24:47,304
You know a lot about this case
you're not telling us, don't you?
451
00:24:47,381 --> 00:24:50,560
Uh, no,
nothing more than what I already said.
452
00:24:50,637 --> 00:24:51,958
We talked to Frank.
453
00:24:52,035 --> 00:24:54,542
He paints a different picture
of your relationship with Beverly.
454
00:24:54,599 --> 00:24:57,857
He said you made up that part
about you and her being engaged.
455
00:24:58,332 --> 00:24:59,715
Uh...
456
00:24:59,792 --> 00:25:01,612
Well, I didn't have a ring yet,
457
00:25:01,689 --> 00:25:05,388
but, um, but I asked her and she said yes.
458
00:25:05,465 --> 00:25:08,200
It sounded like she wanted
to keep her options open.
459
00:25:11,179 --> 00:25:12,580
[Tench] Benjamin?
460
00:25:15,058 --> 00:25:16,565
Did Frank say that?
461
00:25:16,642 --> 00:25:18,461
[Tench] He said a lot of things.
462
00:25:20,521 --> 00:25:22,341
- 'Cause he was jealous.
- [Holden] Jealous?
463
00:25:22,418 --> 00:25:23,968
Why would he be jealous?
464
00:25:24,045 --> 00:25:25,970
He's married. To your sister.
465
00:25:26,047 --> 00:25:27,385
Well...
466
00:25:28,696 --> 00:25:31,914
He was always asking when...
she was coming around,
467
00:25:31,991 --> 00:25:35,104
always talking to her
like she was his girlfriend.
468
00:25:35,181 --> 00:25:37,607
- What do you mean?
- Like "Hey, hon,"
469
00:25:37,684 --> 00:25:41,942
"Hey, babe,"
"Hey, sweetheart, go get me a beer."
470
00:25:42,376 --> 00:25:43,776
And...
471
00:25:45,046 --> 00:25:47,531
he was always getting her
to sit on his lap.
472
00:25:47,799 --> 00:25:51,454
- Did she want to sit on his lap?
- She had to or it would've been rude.
473
00:25:51,531 --> 00:25:54,979
- Did he try to have sex with her?
- No, it didn't go that far.
474
00:25:55,056 --> 00:25:56,876
[Holden] He told us he was interested.
475
00:25:56,953 --> 00:25:59,984
Beverly Jean was a beautiful woman.
She wouldn't do that.
476
00:26:00,061 --> 00:26:03,112
- Do what, have sex? She had sex with you.
- She loved me.
477
00:26:03,189 --> 00:26:05,843
But she wasn't exactly
saving herself for marriage.
478
00:26:05,920 --> 00:26:08,260
[Benjamin sobbing]
479
00:26:08,444 --> 00:26:10,348
Do you think you satisfied her, Benjamin?
480
00:26:10,425 --> 00:26:13,182
[bell rings]
481
00:26:24,544 --> 00:26:26,531
Did you see her that night
when she got off work?
482
00:26:26,608 --> 00:26:28,929
No. I was home, I was watching television.
483
00:26:29,006 --> 00:26:31,369
Didn't you want her to come over,
hang out with you?
484
00:26:31,446 --> 00:26:34,831
Of course I wanted her to come over,
because I loved her.
485
00:26:34,908 --> 00:26:37,289
[sobbing] Now she's dead.
486
00:26:38,182 --> 00:26:41,252
Oh, my God!
487
00:26:41,435 --> 00:26:43,712
Oh, my God!
488
00:26:45,148 --> 00:26:48,884
- ♪♪ Soft music plays...
- [indistinct chatter]
489
00:26:49,057 --> 00:26:52,601
♪♪
490
00:26:53,573 --> 00:26:55,683
So did Beverly Jean sleep around?
491
00:26:57,910 --> 00:27:00,898
- Alvin tried to pick her up at a bar.
- She turned him down.
492
00:27:00,975 --> 00:27:02,775
[Holden] What was she doing at a bar?
493
00:27:02,852 --> 00:27:05,820
- Having a drink?
- Was she alone, with a girlfriend?
494
00:27:05,897 --> 00:27:07,238
What would that tell us?
495
00:27:07,315 --> 00:27:09,011
A single woman in a bar...
496
00:27:09,088 --> 00:27:11,367
A single woman might go alone
just to have a drink.
497
00:27:11,444 --> 00:27:14,368
What about her?
Is she trying to pick someone up?
498
00:27:14,635 --> 00:27:17,580
- Well, probably.
- Why, because she's by herself?
499
00:27:17,657 --> 00:27:19,290
Because she's at a bar?
500
00:27:20,242 --> 00:27:21,502
- Yeah.
- That's an assumption.
501
00:27:21,579 --> 00:27:24,693
Say she is looking for someone,
does that make her easy?
502
00:27:24,770 --> 00:27:26,730
Is she looking for a husband
or a one-night stand?
503
00:27:26,793 --> 00:27:28,593
Does the difference
change your perception?
504
00:27:28,670 --> 00:27:29,949
- Sure.
- Why?
505
00:27:30,026 --> 00:27:34,620
Well, changes whether
I'd be interested in her, theoretically.
506
00:27:34,697 --> 00:27:37,810
What if you're looking
for a one-night stand... theoretically?
507
00:27:37,887 --> 00:27:40,251
No, I don't... It's not my thing.
508
00:27:40,383 --> 00:27:42,105
- Come on, Mark.
- [Tench] Leave him alone.
509
00:27:42,163 --> 00:27:46,068
Beverly's sexual history is only important
because if she was seeing other men,
510
00:27:46,145 --> 00:27:47,778
then obviously they're suspects.
511
00:27:47,855 --> 00:27:49,695
So who else can we talk to?
512
00:27:52,381 --> 00:27:56,100
There's a couple of friends
we could question... again.
513
00:27:56,177 --> 00:27:58,412
Anyone else she might have confided in?
514
00:27:58,721 --> 00:28:01,915
She did just get her hair done. Right?
515
00:28:03,809 --> 00:28:04,891
Here's a question,
516
00:28:04,961 --> 00:28:07,590
if it is Benjamin or some other boyfriend
who freaked out on her,
517
00:28:07,667 --> 00:28:10,007
does the case merit our involvement?
518
00:28:10,983 --> 00:28:14,661
We still can't rule out a sequence killer,
but if the perpetrator was a townie,
519
00:28:14,719 --> 00:28:17,638
then the crime is random, and there's
no expectation that he'll be repeating it.
520
00:28:17,695 --> 00:28:20,937
Here's my question, shouldn't our funding
cover separate rooms?
521
00:28:21,014 --> 00:28:22,770
You don't like my company?
522
00:28:22,995 --> 00:28:24,772
We'll get connecting doors.
523
00:28:42,348 --> 00:28:46,126
The mutilation of her body alone
justifies our involvement.
524
00:28:48,145 --> 00:28:51,256
Would you mind sitting
on your own bed, please?
525
00:29:18,009 --> 00:29:19,827
Well, that was a dead end.
526
00:29:19,904 --> 00:29:21,060
Who's next?
527
00:29:21,137 --> 00:29:24,039
One of the families she baby-sat for,
the Snyders.
528
00:29:25,099 --> 00:29:28,337
You mind if we take a quick detour?
Something's been bugging me.
529
00:29:28,414 --> 00:29:29,752
[Tench] Okay.
530
00:29:52,501 --> 00:29:53,901
Hi, Rose.
531
00:29:57,882 --> 00:29:59,243
I just got him to sleep.
532
00:29:59,320 --> 00:30:01,016
Pretty hard having a newborn.
533
00:30:01,093 --> 00:30:03,122
All anybody ever tells you
is how great it is.
534
00:30:03,199 --> 00:30:07,043
But my wife and I, with both our kids,
we walked around like zombies
535
00:30:07,120 --> 00:30:08,876
for the first three months.
536
00:30:10,144 --> 00:30:12,570
You know, Trinity Lutheran,
over on Sycamore,
537
00:30:12,647 --> 00:30:14,280
has a program for single moms.
538
00:30:14,357 --> 00:30:16,574
Not that you're single,
but it's your first child
539
00:30:16,651 --> 00:30:19,972
and they'll have all kinds of information
on feeding him, getting him to sleep.
540
00:30:20,049 --> 00:30:22,389
- Thanks.
- What about Frank?
541
00:30:22,490 --> 00:30:24,663
- He help you out?
- [Rose] When he can.
542
00:30:24,757 --> 00:30:25,791
He's got work.
543
00:30:25,868 --> 00:30:28,522
Your mom certainly seems excited
about having a grandbaby.
544
00:30:28,599 --> 00:30:30,147
[Rose] She is happy.
545
00:30:30,289 --> 00:30:32,608
And Benjamin, is he helping?
546
00:30:33,084 --> 00:30:36,445
- [scoffs] No.
- You close with Benjamin?
547
00:30:36,629 --> 00:30:38,280
He's my older brother.
548
00:30:38,881 --> 00:30:40,324
[Tench] By how much?
549
00:30:40,925 --> 00:30:42,057
Fourteen months.
550
00:30:42,134 --> 00:30:44,244
You have good memories growing up?
551
00:30:44,387 --> 00:30:47,062
Mom went to work. Got two jobs.
552
00:30:47,139 --> 00:30:49,368
Two kids, two jobs. How'd she swing that?
553
00:30:49,426 --> 00:30:51,379
Me and Benji went to school
a couple blocks over.
554
00:30:51,456 --> 00:30:53,214
We would walk home in the afternoon.
555
00:30:53,291 --> 00:30:56,342
- And you were how old?
- Ten. Maybe eleven.
556
00:30:56,419 --> 00:30:57,800
That's pretty young.
557
00:30:57,900 --> 00:31:01,720
Mom would come home tired,
wasn't really up for dealing with kids.
558
00:31:02,196 --> 00:31:05,682
- I'd make sure the house was clean.
- It's no small feat.
559
00:31:07,868 --> 00:31:11,146
- How old were you when you met Frank?
- Sixteen.
560
00:31:11,288 --> 00:31:14,233
You know about the incident with Frank
in high school?
561
00:31:16,711 --> 00:31:18,612
It was before I met him.
562
00:31:19,130 --> 00:31:23,283
- [Tench] You ever talk with him about it?
- [Rose] He told me it was some accident.
563
00:31:24,760 --> 00:31:26,161
Rose...
564
00:31:26,929 --> 00:31:28,705
you knew Beverly Jean.
565
00:31:30,015 --> 00:31:31,625
What was she like?
566
00:31:31,702 --> 00:31:33,585
She was really sweet.
567
00:31:33,936 --> 00:31:36,006
[Holden] You think she
was good for Benjamin?
568
00:31:36,083 --> 00:31:38,132
She made him want to leave home.
569
00:31:38,774 --> 00:31:40,425
I thought that was good.
570
00:31:41,736 --> 00:31:45,182
We gave him money for a security deposit.
Signed his lease.
571
00:31:45,259 --> 00:31:47,141
Did she intend to marry him?
572
00:31:48,868 --> 00:31:50,519
He was working on her.
573
00:31:50,596 --> 00:31:53,772
Was she... seeing other men?
574
00:31:56,542 --> 00:31:58,884
Benjamin thought she might be.
575
00:31:58,961 --> 00:32:00,529
Benjamin told you this?
576
00:32:02,965 --> 00:32:06,410
He said he thought
she was giving him the runaround.
577
00:32:07,094 --> 00:32:09,454
Getting done up for other guys.
578
00:32:09,847 --> 00:32:10,896
Done up how?
579
00:32:10,973 --> 00:32:13,000
Dressing provocatively?
580
00:32:13,225 --> 00:32:15,504
Painting her nails? Wearing perfume?
581
00:32:15,581 --> 00:32:16,962
Getting her hair done.
582
00:32:17,605 --> 00:32:21,425
[Tench] Frank told us he was with you
the night Beverly Jean was murdered.
583
00:32:21,650 --> 00:32:23,468
- Is that true?
- Yes.
584
00:32:25,196 --> 00:32:26,638
Well, uh...
585
00:32:28,574 --> 00:32:30,728
he went out to get us food.
586
00:32:30,805 --> 00:32:34,897
- How long was he gone?
- [baby cries]
587
00:32:49,678 --> 00:32:53,332
[baby cooing]
588
00:32:54,767 --> 00:32:57,211
Rose, if you are hiding something
589
00:32:57,561 --> 00:33:01,048
and they find out about it,
it will not be good for you...
590
00:33:01,816 --> 00:33:03,258
or for him.
591
00:33:03,901 --> 00:33:07,262
[baby cries]
592
00:33:24,380 --> 00:33:25,989
What are we missing?
593
00:33:29,426 --> 00:33:31,977
- Did you see those bruises on her arm?
- [Tench] Yeah.
594
00:33:32,054 --> 00:33:33,207
You think Frank did that?
595
00:33:33,284 --> 00:33:36,875
Her mother told us that he wouldn't let
anyone else get close to her.
596
00:33:38,352 --> 00:33:39,912
Should we search Frank's car?
597
00:33:40,312 --> 00:33:42,672
- I would need a warrant.
- [Tench] Let's get one.
598
00:33:44,900 --> 00:33:48,345
Mark. There's a young woman downstairs
asking for you.
599
00:33:59,456 --> 00:34:00,857
Hi, Rose.
600
00:34:06,380 --> 00:34:08,073
[stammers] Do...
[clears throat]
601
00:34:10,426 --> 00:34:14,329
[whispers] Do you promise my baby will
be okay if I tell you what happened?
602
00:34:14,972 --> 00:34:16,372
Of course.
603
00:34:20,811 --> 00:34:22,211
It's okay.
604
00:34:23,606 --> 00:34:26,049
- It's okay. Hey.
- [sobs]
605
00:34:33,782 --> 00:34:38,145
So you said Frank was not home
the night Beverly Jean disappeared?
606
00:34:40,289 --> 00:34:41,689
Yes.
607
00:34:41,916 --> 00:34:43,650
Do you know where he was?
608
00:34:45,586 --> 00:34:46,986
Yes.
609
00:34:48,255 --> 00:34:49,698
Where was he?
610
00:34:50,424 --> 00:34:53,618
Benji called us that night
and asked Frank to come over.
611
00:34:56,180 --> 00:34:57,664
Okay.
612
00:34:58,766 --> 00:35:00,500
So Frank left.
613
00:35:00,684 --> 00:35:02,419
How long was he gone?
614
00:35:06,482 --> 00:35:09,803
He called after two or three hours.
Asked me to come over there too.
615
00:35:09,880 --> 00:35:12,806
- What time was this?
- Ten or eleven?
616
00:35:12,883 --> 00:35:15,182
But I told him I was tired.
617
00:35:15,532 --> 00:35:17,601
My back hurt. My feet.
618
00:35:19,828 --> 00:35:22,129
I was more than eight months pregnant.
619
00:35:22,206 --> 00:35:24,610
Did he say why
he wanted you to come over?
620
00:35:24,687 --> 00:35:26,026
No.
621
00:35:27,127 --> 00:35:29,071
He just said to come?
622
00:35:29,254 --> 00:35:31,448
He said to bring cleaning supplies.
623
00:35:34,677 --> 00:35:37,162
But... I forgot.
624
00:35:40,557 --> 00:35:43,043
Drove over, let myself in.
625
00:35:43,268 --> 00:35:47,341
Frank was in the living room.
He told me not to get upset.
626
00:35:47,418 --> 00:35:48,924
Was he upset?
627
00:35:49,525 --> 00:35:50,967
He was calm.
628
00:35:51,193 --> 00:35:54,429
Okay. So Frank tells you
not to get upset...
629
00:35:56,031 --> 00:35:59,226
He told me something bad had happened.
630
00:36:00,703 --> 00:36:05,148
My mind started racing, I was worried
something had happened to Benji.
631
00:36:07,751 --> 00:36:10,612
Frank said, "He's fine,
but he's done something."
632
00:36:13,007 --> 00:36:14,825
Benjamin did something?
633
00:36:17,636 --> 00:36:19,036
Yes.
634
00:36:20,848 --> 00:36:22,791
I said, "What's he done?"
635
00:36:24,143 --> 00:36:27,629
He said he got mad at Beverly Jean.
636
00:36:37,406 --> 00:36:40,058
[Rose] Frank said Benjamin hit her.
637
00:36:41,493 --> 00:36:43,687
I asked if she was okay.
638
00:36:48,167 --> 00:36:50,863
Frank said,
"We got to help Benjamin out of this.
639
00:36:50,940 --> 00:36:54,114
We got to stick together
or he's going to get in trouble."
640
00:36:57,801 --> 00:36:59,870
I asked where Benjamin was.
641
00:37:00,554 --> 00:37:02,539
He said, "He's in the bathroom."
642
00:37:03,724 --> 00:37:06,793
I said, "I want to see him."
He said, "Okay.
643
00:37:07,978 --> 00:37:10,380
But Beverly Jean is in there too."
644
00:37:12,900 --> 00:37:14,593
The door was open.
645
00:37:14,902 --> 00:37:17,119
I saw Benji. He...
646
00:37:17,196 --> 00:37:20,307
He had his head in his hands,
he was crying.
647
00:37:20,824 --> 00:37:23,810
There was blood everywhere.
648
00:37:23,911 --> 00:37:25,479
Splashing.
649
00:37:26,997 --> 00:37:29,816
And then I see Beverly Jean
in the bathtub.
650
00:37:31,293 --> 00:37:32,986
Was she alive?
651
00:37:35,005 --> 00:37:36,405
Dead.
652
00:37:37,841 --> 00:37:40,911
She had her top on, but no panties.
653
00:37:42,846 --> 00:37:46,124
I said, "Benji, what have you done?"
654
00:37:47,643 --> 00:37:50,212
He shook his head.
He didn't want to look at me.
655
00:37:50,437 --> 00:37:53,113
- Was she face up, face down?
- Face up.
656
00:37:53,190 --> 00:37:54,966
Did you notice any wounds?
657
00:37:55,359 --> 00:37:58,011
I couldn't tell, there was a lot of blood.
658
00:37:58,195 --> 00:37:59,745
Then what happened?
659
00:37:59,822 --> 00:38:03,350
Then Frank brought in a tarp,
spread it on the floor.
660
00:38:03,450 --> 00:38:06,561
Then he asked me
to go get cleaning supplies.
661
00:38:06,912 --> 00:38:08,857
When I came back,
they had already rolled her up.
662
00:38:08,934 --> 00:38:12,359
So they took her out to Frank's truck
and drove off.
663
00:38:13,961 --> 00:38:16,696
I washed out the tub
and cleaned up the bathroom.
664
00:38:16,964 --> 00:38:20,265
I scrubbed the tiles, in the cracks,
665
00:38:20,342 --> 00:38:22,536
the grouting, the window frame.
666
00:38:23,011 --> 00:38:26,748
I had to wash all the blood
down the sink and that seemed to...
667
00:38:27,099 --> 00:38:28,750
It took forever...
668
00:38:29,309 --> 00:38:31,586
trying to get it all to go down.
669
00:38:32,938 --> 00:38:36,009
- [Tench] Did you see a weapon?
- There was a knife in the tub.
670
00:38:36,086 --> 00:38:37,717
What'd you do with it?
671
00:38:38,694 --> 00:38:39,888
[Rose] I rinsed it off.
672
00:38:39,965 --> 00:38:43,390
Took it to the kitchen,
washed it with dish soap.
673
00:38:43,467 --> 00:38:45,058
Put it away.
674
00:38:48,412 --> 00:38:49,836
And then I went home.
675
00:38:49,913 --> 00:38:52,776
[Holden] Did you see Frank or Benjamin
again that night?
676
00:38:52,853 --> 00:38:53,757
[Rose] No.
677
00:38:53,834 --> 00:38:56,111
Frank came home early the next morning.
678
00:38:58,797 --> 00:39:00,282
Why did you help them?
679
00:39:02,801 --> 00:39:05,161
It's just what I've always done.
680
00:39:07,181 --> 00:39:08,665
Who killed her?
681
00:39:10,684 --> 00:39:12,294
I don't know.